Thread: Lat Pulldown vs Pullup

Is there any difference between a Lat pulldown and a Wide grip pulllup? Its the same movement, but is there a difference? If so, should you alternate the exercises/do them both?

I've been told that its the difference between an open chain and a closed chain movement. What exactly does that mean?

Thanks!

Yea id do both. Pullups win though

Lat pull downs win because you can use heavier weights and tense/flex your back more than you could from a pull up.

Hm, would you do both in the same session?

Yeah I've definitely found that the pulldowns are easier, which is why I was wondering if maybe there was actually a difference in results.

Yea. Do both in the same session. Lat-pulldowns are better for lat development. But if you want the whole package pull ups win.

Pullups, Do pulldowns until you can do pullups.

i also go with lat pull also because you can add heavier weights..

you can use a belt to add weight on pullups. Pullups are usually superior to pulldowns in most situations.

Yea id say pullups are ore superior (providing you can do them) Because you can add weight and its a 100% natural movement.

If your going to fall from a cliff and your hanging on for your life, pullups would help you pull yourself up more than a lat pulldown would

Originally Posted by Karky

you can use a belt to add weight on pullups. Pullups are usually superior to pulldowns in most situations.

I agree.

So..I'll include both in my back workout - but if I can only do one for whateve reason, I'll do the pullup (Which is still assisted at the moment, but I'm working on that) Thanks!

The pulldown is great when you are cutting, or when you are doing pyramid workouts with or without recovery, it's a killer.

Neither wins, because the intensity varies upon the resistance you can handle.

An advantage to lat pulldowns is you can more easily customize the angle such as doing more of an upper back row by leaning back (or standing up away from the seat) and you can be more sure of the resistance you're using. It's easier to set a stack than it is to weigh yourself or hold a dumbbell in feat or use a dip belt to attach plates.

An advantage to pull ups is that you can have perhaps a more comfortable variety of leg positions other than hip flexion. The sensation of moving through space is pleasant.

People who say pull ups are harder are being silly: either can be harder, it depends on the resistance being used.

Originally Posted by sarafo

I've been told that its the difference between an open chain and a closed chain movement. What exactly does that mean?

Closed chain is when your limbs stay fixed and torso moves. Open chain is when torso is fixed and limbs move.

It's significant for pressing exercises. Insignificant for pulling movements.

Originally Posted by Big_Idiot

Yea id do both. Pullups win though

Win at what? Silly.

Originally Posted by Phate89

Lat pull downs win because you can use heavier weights

This is not an inherent property. People can weight pull ups in excess of the maximum resistance some machines provide (some only go up to 300 for example). Similarly, the machines often go in excess of what people can comfortable attach to themselves (not everyone has a dip belt).

Originally Posted by Phate89

tense/flex your back more than you could from a pull up.

I don't understand this, explain further?

Originally Posted by sarafo

Hm, would you do both in the same session?

This is a valid option, yes.

Originally Posted by sarafo

Yeah I've definitely found that the pulldowns are easier, which is why I was wondering if maybe there was actually a difference in results.

If you're finding them easier, increase the weight.

This open-closed chain debate is pretty ridiculous in regards to pull ups/downs. The debate has much more merit in relation to benching and push ups due to scapular mobility and the instability of pushing movements, yet we still have throngs of benchers and people who do both.

If I was a 200lb guy who felt bench pressing was easier than doing push ups but I was only benching the bar and a couple 10lb plates (let's say 65lbs) then clearly the fault is not that of the bench press but that I'm just not weighting the tool enough. The same applies to the lat pulldown. If it's so easy, increase the weight.

The only valid complaint against lat pulldowns is if you reach the maximum for your stack and are hitting it for decent reps and want bigger resistance. This is a problem faced by some cheaper stations, like the ones from Wal-mart which only go up to 140 or 160 for example. Most gyms' go up to something like 300 though, and I'm doubtful most people complaining can pull that for many reps in good form.

Originally Posted by Phate89

Lat-pulldowns are better for lat development.

Why? The lats are developed from both movements.

Originally Posted by Phate89

But if you want the whole package pull ups win.

The whole package of what? What is it that a pull up would train better that a pull down would not train as well?

Originally Posted by NBS 4life

Pullups, Do pulldowns until you can do pullups.

Why not just keep doing the pull downs even after one can do pull ups? I do pull ups because they're fun and impress others, not because they're necessarily more effective.

Originally Posted by sabel3

i also go with lat pull also because you can add heavier weights..

You can add weight to your body with a pull up as well, but if your point is that it's easier to simply up the stack on the down, I agree.

Originally Posted by Karky

Pullups are usually superior to pulldowns in most situations.

Why?

Originally Posted by Big_Idiot

pullups are ore superior Because you can add weight

This makes no sense because you can add weight to pull downs.

Originally Posted by Big_Idiot

and its a 100% natural movement.

So what exactly are pull downs, 50% supernatural?

Originally Posted by Big_Idiot

If your going to fall from a cliff and your hanging on for your life, pullups would help you pull yourself up more than a lat pulldown would

Irrelevant, pull ups aren't likely to be enough to save someone from falling off a cliff. It would be more beneficial to practice things like muscle ups and climbing actual ledges learning to use one's feet. Assuming one doesn't muscle up (it's harder on a cliff because you can't kip, torso/legs can't go forward at bottom) then one would need to learn to hold one's weight on 1 hand while the other elbow is lifted overtop.

Cliffs also don't tend to have nice rounded bars on them, so you'd be better of training on difficult things to grip such as thick bars, eagle loops or steel beams.

Originally Posted by sarafo

if I can only do one for whateve reason, I'll do the pullup

I doubt you'll be in a situation where you have access to both movements but can only choose one of them. If you're in a situation where you can only do one then it will be due to equipment limitations. Like if you didn't have access to a lat pulldown then yeah, pull ups are doable in a wide variety of places. If you do have access to one, unless the gym has rules against it, any lat pulldown bar can be used as a pull up bar by setting the stack on maximum as long as it's greater than your weight. The only trouble with that is if it's mounted on a single cable instead of 2 then you might spin around.

I always start my back day with pullups. Mentally it's just one of those things I get a kick out of seeing progress. Kinda like benching more weight. I know, it's weird. My pulldown has increased from 180 lbs to 220 lbs, but I could care less. My pullups have increased from being able to do 5 to being able to do 12, and I'm like Yippee!! (Which is sad in itself since I used to be able to do millions of them when I was a scawny teenager)